(richardatf) Matthew 23:9 And call no [man] your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Call anyone father recently? Do you allow others to call YOU father?
(Cristoiglesia)Sure I call the Father in heaven Father. I also called my dad father and my fellow priests. Allow me to show you what happens when one uses eisegesis to understand Scriptures or take them out of context with this from my blog:
From the early Church we find that clergy were addressed as father. There are those with little knowledge of history or hermeneutical discipline such as understanding Scriptures within context, who believe that the Bible prohibits one from calling a priest father. The words they rely on come directly from Christ:
(Mat 23:9 DRB) And call none your father upon earth; for one is your father, who is in heaven.
Keeping the verse in context let us look at the verse preceding this verse:
(Mat 23:8 DRB) But be not you called Rabbi. For one is your master: and all you are brethren.
Rabbi means teacher and the Latin word for teacher is doctor so anyone using these terms as well are violating the literal interpretation of the text.
Let us look at the verse after verse 9:
(Mat 23:10 DRB) Neither be ye called masters: for one is your master, Christ.
There is no way that the interpretation could be correct if one reads and understands the Matthew passage in context. He is clearly teaching that one should not look to any human authority as our teacher, father, master, doctor or other titles of respect but instead give to God those things that are reserved for Him. Do you also refuse to call people doctor, teacher, professor, mister, or master? All of these are forbidden as well if we are to accept a literal understanding.
Context also requires that we investigate what the other Scriptures say as well as the understanding of these words by those who followed Christ. There are many instances where the writers of the New Testament contradict a literal understanding of not calling a man father, teacher or master. Consider the following verses:
(Act 5:34 DRB) But one in the council rising up, a Pharisee, named Gamaliel, a doctor of the law, respected by all the people, commanded the men to be put forth a little while.
(Col 4:1 DRB) Masters, do to your servants that which is just and equal: knowing that you also have a master in heaven.
(2Ti 1:11 DRB) Wherein I am appointed a preacher and an apostle and teacher of the Gentiles.
Let us examine the statements of St. Stephen to see if he understood Christ to be speaking literally….In is soliloquy (Acts Chapter 7) before the Sanhedrin before his stoning to martyrdom he used the term father in referring to Abraham Isaac and Jacob as fathers and also to his Israelite ancestors as fathers.
St. John the beloved disciple also did not understand Christ to be teaching literally as we can see in the following verses:
(1Jn 2:13 DRB) I write unto you, fathers, because you have known him who is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because you have overcome the wicked one.
(1Jn 2:14 DRB) I write unto you, babes, because you have known the Father. I write unto you, young men, because you are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and you have overcome the wicked one.
(1Jn 2:15 DRB) Love not the world, nor the things which are in the world. If any man love the world, the charity of the Father is not in him.
(1Jn 2:16 DRB) For all that is in the world is the concupiscence of the flesh and the concupiscence of the eyes and the pride of life, which is not of the Father but is of the world.
St. Paul also had a different understanding of Christ’s words than the literalists:
(1Co 4:14 DRB) I write not these things to confound you: but I admonish you as my dearest children.
(1Co 4:15 DRB) For if you have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet not many fathers. For in Christ Jesus, by the gospel, I have begotten you.
(1Co 4:16 DRB) Wherefore, I beseech you, be ye followers of me as I also am of Christ.
St. Paul was speaking of the fact that he is called to shepherd the flock as are all priests. We not only give birth to the Christian through Baptism but also nourish the faithful with the Holy Eucharist and God’s Word. We care for them and bind their spiritual wounds through the delivery of the Sacraments. It is no wonder that we are called father as we care for our Church family as a father cares for his own family.
God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
27 July, 2009
Discussion with richardatf about Idolatry
(richardatf) The picture is not an idol granted, the statue is. The foot of the statue of "St Peter" (which is actually a statue of the Roman god Jupiter) has been worn away by all the lips of the worshiping catholic people who have kissed it. How many times have you been on your knees before a statue of Mary? This is worship.
(Cristoiglesia)A statue is not necessarily an idol. It can also be a work of art. For it to be an idol one has to believe it to be a God and to worship it as a God. Catholics are forbidden in the Catechism of the Catholic Church to worship anyone or anything but God. Here is what the Catechism says:
Idolatry
2112 The first commandment condemns polytheism. It requires man neither to believe in, nor to venerate, other divinities than the one true God. Scripture constantly recalls this rejection of "idols, [of] silver and gold, the work of men's hands. They have mouths, but do not speak; eyes, but do not see." These empty idols make their worshippers empty: "Those who make them are like them; so are all who trust in them."42 God, however, is the "living God"43 who gives life and intervenes in history.
2113 Idolatry not only refers to false pagan worship. It remains a constant temptation to faith. Idolatry consists in divinizing what is not God. Man commits idolatry whenever he honors and reveres a creature in place of God, whether this be gods or demons (for example, satanism), power, pleasure, race, ancestors, the state, money, etc. Jesus says, "You cannot serve God and mammon."44 Many martyrs died for not adoring "the Beast"45 refusing even to simulate such worship. Idolatry rejects the unique Lordship of God; it is therefore incompatible with communion with God.46
2114 Human life finds its unity in the adoration of the one God. The commandment to worship the Lord alone integrates man and saves him from an endless disintegration. Idolatry is a perversion of man's innate religious sense. An idolater is someone who "transfers his indestructible notion of God to anything other than God."47
How is a statue of St. Peter a statue of the Roman God Jupiter? Are you trying to say that they are one in the same person? Excuse me for saying this but that is an idiotic assumption. Are you trying also to draw a parallel that kissing an object or I would guess also a person is somehow in your mind worshipping them? I assume you kiss your loved ones, does that mean that they are your Gods and you worship them? How do you come to this leap of logic?
I have never prayed on my knees before a statue of the blessed mother but I am not opposed to it. Why would you be? I even pray while kneeling beside my bed. In your twisted logic I guess I would be accused of worshipping my bed.
(richardatf) The catholic symbol for the "host" is a sun, put it in a well named sunburst monstrance and we see only one example of sunworship in catholicism.
No, the sun is not a symbol of the host in the Blessed Sacrament. There is no sun worship in Catholicism. The truly real and substantial Body of our Lord is placed in the monstrance which depicts by the rays of light coming from His Body that He is truly the light of the world and the object of our worship.
John 8:12 (King James Version)
12Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
(Cristoiglesia)A statue is not necessarily an idol. It can also be a work of art. For it to be an idol one has to believe it to be a God and to worship it as a God. Catholics are forbidden in the Catechism of the Catholic Church to worship anyone or anything but God. Here is what the Catechism says:
Idolatry
2112 The first commandment condemns polytheism. It requires man neither to believe in, nor to venerate, other divinities than the one true God. Scripture constantly recalls this rejection of "idols, [of] silver and gold, the work of men's hands. They have mouths, but do not speak; eyes, but do not see." These empty idols make their worshippers empty: "Those who make them are like them; so are all who trust in them."42 God, however, is the "living God"43 who gives life and intervenes in history.
2113 Idolatry not only refers to false pagan worship. It remains a constant temptation to faith. Idolatry consists in divinizing what is not God. Man commits idolatry whenever he honors and reveres a creature in place of God, whether this be gods or demons (for example, satanism), power, pleasure, race, ancestors, the state, money, etc. Jesus says, "You cannot serve God and mammon."44 Many martyrs died for not adoring "the Beast"45 refusing even to simulate such worship. Idolatry rejects the unique Lordship of God; it is therefore incompatible with communion with God.46
2114 Human life finds its unity in the adoration of the one God. The commandment to worship the Lord alone integrates man and saves him from an endless disintegration. Idolatry is a perversion of man's innate religious sense. An idolater is someone who "transfers his indestructible notion of God to anything other than God."47
How is a statue of St. Peter a statue of the Roman God Jupiter? Are you trying to say that they are one in the same person? Excuse me for saying this but that is an idiotic assumption. Are you trying also to draw a parallel that kissing an object or I would guess also a person is somehow in your mind worshipping them? I assume you kiss your loved ones, does that mean that they are your Gods and you worship them? How do you come to this leap of logic?
I have never prayed on my knees before a statue of the blessed mother but I am not opposed to it. Why would you be? I even pray while kneeling beside my bed. In your twisted logic I guess I would be accused of worshipping my bed.
(richardatf) The catholic symbol for the "host" is a sun, put it in a well named sunburst monstrance and we see only one example of sunworship in catholicism.
No, the sun is not a symbol of the host in the Blessed Sacrament. There is no sun worship in Catholicism. The truly real and substantial Body of our Lord is placed in the monstrance which depicts by the rays of light coming from His Body that He is truly the light of the world and the object of our worship.
John 8:12 (King James Version)
12Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
25 July, 2009
(LottaLou) Everyone else is born with sin nature and sin. Since the wages of sin is death, all die physically. None of the Saints are raised up flesh & bone like Jesus raised up yet. Their souls R made spiritual; Only their spiritual souls are in heaven. Not their corruptible body. The body has to be changed in the twinkle of an eye yet.
(Cristoiglesia) I agree that we are all born with the original sin of our first parents. However, I believe that you are forgetting about Elijah who was also raised up to heaven. We can also speculate about Moses as well as the Scriptures suggests that he was assumed into heaven also. So it is not unreasonable that our Lord would do the same for His mother. We also have the same situation as with Moses where there is no grave for the mother of God who was greatly honored by the early Church during her life. So while being unusual, it would be reasonable for Jesus not to want his mother to be corrupted by the results of death.
(Cristoiglesia) Jesus redemptive work transcends time & offers salvation to all past, present and future. The blessed mother simply received this grace at her conception.
(LottaLou)I agree but I don't understand receiving grace at conception.
(Cristoiglesia) We both can agree, I assume, that it is our Lord who provided for our salvific grace. The teaching of the Church from Pentecost onward is that Jesus provided this grace at the conception of the blessed mother of God to prepare her for her role in salvation. It had to be at the moment of conception otherwise original sin would be present as this sin nature is carried by the semen as we discussed before. The Grace applied by God prevented this sin nature by the salvific grace being applied simultaneously with conception. Theologically, it is impossible for God to be born of an impure vessel and the Archangel Gabriel recognized the blessed state of the blessed mother calling her “full of grace”. Being full of grace does not leave room for anything but salvific grace and the angel gives witness to this fact. Within her there was no room for sin or even a sinful nature by God’s grace.
(LottaLou)Specifically, what is the Gnostic beliefs which is the Vineyard sects?
(Cristoiglesia) John Wimber the founder of the Vineyard movement used to say that “God is greater than His Word” and would suggest that revelation does not have to be in accordance with Scripture to be true. Wimber taught that these revelations could indeed be contradictory and still be true. Some speculate this comes from his Quaker roots but His teaching that inner revelation is above or equal to the Word of God came from Quakerism. Is this why he has traces of the belief in the supremacy of the inner revelation over and above the written word? Wimber wrote in his book, "Power Evangelism", Wimber explains:
"God uses our experiences to show us more fully what He teaches us in scripture, many times toppling or altering elements of our theology and world view".
Christian Research Institute says the following about his teaching:
"There appears to be little emphasis on teaching the Bible per se. This lack stands in contrast to the very strong Bible teaching at Calvary Chapel, a church with which The Vineyard was once associated . . .. While Bible teaching is not emphasized enough, the role of experience in the Christian life appears to be somewhat over-emphasized. People in the Vineyard frequently seem to be willing to allow their spiritual experiences be self-authenticating".
(LottaLou)You accused my Pastor as not being called of the LORD and teaching Gnostic beliefs. So what specific Gnostic belief are you referring to?
And you do realize that sometimes what you thought I wrote, I didn't mean... So that is mostly because our writing styles are different.
(Cristoiglesia) I said that no one is called to separate anyone from Christ’s Church. That would never be God’s will because He would be contradicting His own prayer where He prayed that we all be one in His Church like He and the Father are one. He could have been called to teach but not to pastor because that act alone is separating some from Christ’ Church. What you wrote suggest that your pastor taught that revelation is equal to or above God’s Word as if it is an extra biblical revelation that not necessarily has to conform to Scriptural truth. Additionally, You suggested that subjective personal inner experiential revelation is to be trusted equally with Scripture or even above Scripture. As an example, when you have been faced with difficult interpretations during our discussions you have fallen back on inner feelings or “gnosis” as to what is the truth being conveyed by Scripture. This leaves room for great error in my opinion and for the great doctor of the Church St. Irenaeus in His work “Against Heresies”.
(LottaLou) Also, I am learning more about Christianity from reading what you write. So even if I don't agree with everything you write, I still find it interesting.
(Cristoiglesia) Thank you, I feel the same way. Iron sharpens Iron.
God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
(Cristoiglesia) I agree that we are all born with the original sin of our first parents. However, I believe that you are forgetting about Elijah who was also raised up to heaven. We can also speculate about Moses as well as the Scriptures suggests that he was assumed into heaven also. So it is not unreasonable that our Lord would do the same for His mother. We also have the same situation as with Moses where there is no grave for the mother of God who was greatly honored by the early Church during her life. So while being unusual, it would be reasonable for Jesus not to want his mother to be corrupted by the results of death.
(Cristoiglesia) Jesus redemptive work transcends time & offers salvation to all past, present and future. The blessed mother simply received this grace at her conception.
(LottaLou)I agree but I don't understand receiving grace at conception.
(Cristoiglesia) We both can agree, I assume, that it is our Lord who provided for our salvific grace. The teaching of the Church from Pentecost onward is that Jesus provided this grace at the conception of the blessed mother of God to prepare her for her role in salvation. It had to be at the moment of conception otherwise original sin would be present as this sin nature is carried by the semen as we discussed before. The Grace applied by God prevented this sin nature by the salvific grace being applied simultaneously with conception. Theologically, it is impossible for God to be born of an impure vessel and the Archangel Gabriel recognized the blessed state of the blessed mother calling her “full of grace”. Being full of grace does not leave room for anything but salvific grace and the angel gives witness to this fact. Within her there was no room for sin or even a sinful nature by God’s grace.
(LottaLou)Specifically, what is the Gnostic beliefs which is the Vineyard sects?
(Cristoiglesia) John Wimber the founder of the Vineyard movement used to say that “God is greater than His Word” and would suggest that revelation does not have to be in accordance with Scripture to be true. Wimber taught that these revelations could indeed be contradictory and still be true. Some speculate this comes from his Quaker roots but His teaching that inner revelation is above or equal to the Word of God came from Quakerism. Is this why he has traces of the belief in the supremacy of the inner revelation over and above the written word? Wimber wrote in his book, "Power Evangelism", Wimber explains:
"God uses our experiences to show us more fully what He teaches us in scripture, many times toppling or altering elements of our theology and world view".
Christian Research Institute says the following about his teaching:
"There appears to be little emphasis on teaching the Bible per se. This lack stands in contrast to the very strong Bible teaching at Calvary Chapel, a church with which The Vineyard was once associated . . .. While Bible teaching is not emphasized enough, the role of experience in the Christian life appears to be somewhat over-emphasized. People in the Vineyard frequently seem to be willing to allow their spiritual experiences be self-authenticating".
(LottaLou)You accused my Pastor as not being called of the LORD and teaching Gnostic beliefs. So what specific Gnostic belief are you referring to?
And you do realize that sometimes what you thought I wrote, I didn't mean... So that is mostly because our writing styles are different.
(Cristoiglesia) I said that no one is called to separate anyone from Christ’s Church. That would never be God’s will because He would be contradicting His own prayer where He prayed that we all be one in His Church like He and the Father are one. He could have been called to teach but not to pastor because that act alone is separating some from Christ’ Church. What you wrote suggest that your pastor taught that revelation is equal to or above God’s Word as if it is an extra biblical revelation that not necessarily has to conform to Scriptural truth. Additionally, You suggested that subjective personal inner experiential revelation is to be trusted equally with Scripture or even above Scripture. As an example, when you have been faced with difficult interpretations during our discussions you have fallen back on inner feelings or “gnosis” as to what is the truth being conveyed by Scripture. This leaves room for great error in my opinion and for the great doctor of the Church St. Irenaeus in His work “Against Heresies”.
(LottaLou) Also, I am learning more about Christianity from reading what you write. So even if I don't agree with everything you write, I still find it interesting.
(Cristoiglesia) Thank you, I feel the same way. Iron sharpens Iron.
God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
24 July, 2009
Discussion with Mako Koizumi about criticisms of the Church
(Mako Koizumi) Oh, I apologize if I have offended you or your religion in the slightest way possible. However, yes, I am very, very aware that everything I posted about the Catholic church is the wholesome truth. Everything.
(Cristoiglesia) I did not respond to you because I was offended although the false accusations you made are quite offensive. The reason I did so was to encourage you to repent from your sin of bearing false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful. It was from a concern for your soul that it may remain unrepentant for your sin and will die to Christ as a result.
It seems as if you have been the victim of false teachers and that is sad for they have caused you to commit the sin of bearing false witness which is against the Decalogue."
(Mako Koizumi) Actually, that cannot be possible for I have not been taught by false teachers.
(Cristoiglesia) OK, then where did you get the nonsense you posted about Christ’s Church?
(Mako Koizumi) I am assuming what you have shared must be the Catholic way. However, as a Christian, I am not permitted to ALWAYS accept the teachings from higher authority. People are still people. And so, these people who are said to be "holy" can quite be the opposite. But what I do cater to and embrace is the bible, the only God-given truth sent down from heaven.
(Cristoiglesia) I see. So you reject the authority that Christ placed on earth which is His Church for a book about the Church and written by the Church (New Testament) but do not accept the teaching of the Church which the Bible states is the “pillar and foundation of the truth. The Bible further states that it does not contain the fullness of truth of Jesus’ teaching that is contained in the teaching of the Church and preserved by apostolic succession and the teaching authority of the Church given by Jesus. It seems as if you call yourself Christian and then turn from the familial relationship that Jesus founded through His Church for the doctrines of men instead of Christ’s authority given to the Church. That real makes no sense, does it? Jesus is the Word made flesh and not a book. We did not write the New Testament and canonize the Christian Scriptures to be used outside of the Church but as the written supplement to God’s Word which contains both the written and the oral Sacred Traditions. The Bible was certainly inspired by God but it did not fall down from heaven in Elizabethan English. The fact is that the will of Jesus for all Christians is that we do accept the teaching of His Church for at the garden of Gethsemane the night of His arrest He prayed that we all be one in His Church just as He and the Father are one. The Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth lest you call Jesus a liar and an imposter as the Messiah. So, are you calling Jesus a liar by rejecting the authority He gave on earth to His Church which is called the one, holy, Catholic and apostolic Church? There is no other.
(Mako Koizumi) My friend, have you ever thoroughly read the bible? From Genesis TO Revelations, have you, my brother, read it? The truth is from Jesus' teachings, not the doctrines and teachings from your "Mother Church of Rome".
False teachers? No, no, no. It is not my way to just listen to the people and NOT dig into the facts. All these things that I did find were not words from people. It was from research.
(Cristoiglesia) I have read the Bible many times and have taught it to others thoroughly. Are you aware that the entire Bible is taught in the Catholic Church every three years? Have you read the Bible including the New Testament which contains the Testimony of our founders to the teaching of Jesus? But, I have also read the teaching of the Church fathers and of the Church of which Jesus gave all authority on earth. So, what makes you think that your own judgment and intellect is greater than the promise of Jesus that His Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth”? Whether it is one false teacher (yourself) or many you are still the victim of deception by the father of lies and the carnal condition of pride and arrogance that you can usurp the authority that Jesus has given to His Church.
(Mako Koizumi) "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."
-Matthew 16:18
That is not referring to the Catholic church.
(Cristoiglesia) It most certainly is referring to His Church. St. Ignatius who was the third bishop of the bishopric of St. Peter in Antioch and a disciple of St. Peter and of St. John defined the Church as those who gather around the Bishop in apostolic succession. Do you know more about the definition of the Church than one who learned at the foot of two of our Lord’s chosen; who are two of the foundation stones of the Church according to our Lord? Why is this not an example of pride as well as disobedience?
Here is where you were bearing false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) Did you know the Catholic church also:
a. Departed from faith - They teach different ways to get into heaven. Examples are purgatory and good deeds (things that are strictly not stated in the bible).
(Cristoiglesia) You obviously do not know what the Church teaches about faith. The Church teaches that we are saved by God’s grace through faith. What do you believe different than this? People who go through the process of purgation are already saved and are being thoroughly cleaned of the dross of sin before they can come into the presence of God. There are no sinful souls in heaven. Good deeds which certainly are evidence of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit do not merit heaven and this is not the teaching of the Church. That would be the heresy of Pelagianism and this is forbidden for Catholic Christians to believe or practice. So, this is your first bearing of false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) b. Give heed to seducing spirits - Catholic church has necromancers. These are "mages" who conjure the spirits of the dead to predict or influence future events. That means they consult with the dead which God strongly condemns. It is also called witch craft. (I have proofs if you need any)
(Cristoiglesia) This is the official teaching of the Church from the Catechism of the Catholic Church in regards to your claim:
Divination and magic
2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility. [305]
2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to "unveil" the future. [Cf. Deut 18:10; Jer 29:8] Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one's service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another's credulity.
So this is the second time you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and its faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) c. Create doctrines of devils - This refers to their fabricated doctrines that do not follow the bible.
(Cristoiglesia) There are no doctrines in Catholic teaching that is contradictory to the Bible. Think about it, why would we write the New Testament and canonize the Bible and then teach contradictory to its truths? Such would be illogical thinking. I noticed that you did not mention any of these so called “doctrines of devils”. Do you realize who you are calling devils? The doctrines come from Christ as taught by His disciples. Did you really mean to make that accusation? This is the third time that you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) d. Speak lies in hypocrisy - They believe, share, and teach what Jesus did not preach in the bible.
(Cristoiglesia) There you go again, empty accusations which have no basis in fact. We would never do such a thing. Here you have chosen to bear false witness for the fourth time against Christ’s Church and it’s faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) e. Forbid to marry - This can refer to nuns, but I believe it's pointing more to the homosexuals. The Catholic church is accepting to homosexuality and some even become one themselves. According to the bible, marriage is done with man AND woman. So, whoever does not follow this is forbidding to marry.
(Cristoiglesia) Are you accusing the Church of forbidding anyone to marry? That is a very serious accusation in the light that the first commandment was to go fourth and multiply. The truth is that the Church does not forbid anyone to marry but instead encourages marriage. There are some who choose a celibate life following the example of our Lord and St. Paul but no one forbids them to marry but they make that choice themselves in devotion to our Lord and the Church. Both Jesus and St. Paul taught in favor of the total dedication to the service of the Lord.
What do you mean that we are accepting of homosexuality? The Church condemns these practices. We would agree with you about the definition of marriage so how are we forbidding anyone to marry? We are not. So, for the fifth time you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
You made five claims against the Church that are totally false yet you cannot see where you are committing a grave and egregious sin. If that is not deception I do not know how one would define what you have done.
I believe that someone has taught you these lies about the Church and caused you to sin and to embarrass yourself by repeating the lies. Now that you know the truth you can testify to those that would tell lies about he Church that what they say is false. You are in a position to stop others from sinning and making the same errors as yourself. I thank you for the opportunity to enlighten you to your errors. I pray that your enlightenment about Christ’s own Church will get you on a path to communion into the familial relationship with our Savior in His Church. God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
(Cristoiglesia) I did not respond to you because I was offended although the false accusations you made are quite offensive. The reason I did so was to encourage you to repent from your sin of bearing false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful. It was from a concern for your soul that it may remain unrepentant for your sin and will die to Christ as a result.
It seems as if you have been the victim of false teachers and that is sad for they have caused you to commit the sin of bearing false witness which is against the Decalogue."
(Mako Koizumi) Actually, that cannot be possible for I have not been taught by false teachers.
(Cristoiglesia) OK, then where did you get the nonsense you posted about Christ’s Church?
(Mako Koizumi) I am assuming what you have shared must be the Catholic way. However, as a Christian, I am not permitted to ALWAYS accept the teachings from higher authority. People are still people. And so, these people who are said to be "holy" can quite be the opposite. But what I do cater to and embrace is the bible, the only God-given truth sent down from heaven.
(Cristoiglesia) I see. So you reject the authority that Christ placed on earth which is His Church for a book about the Church and written by the Church (New Testament) but do not accept the teaching of the Church which the Bible states is the “pillar and foundation of the truth. The Bible further states that it does not contain the fullness of truth of Jesus’ teaching that is contained in the teaching of the Church and preserved by apostolic succession and the teaching authority of the Church given by Jesus. It seems as if you call yourself Christian and then turn from the familial relationship that Jesus founded through His Church for the doctrines of men instead of Christ’s authority given to the Church. That real makes no sense, does it? Jesus is the Word made flesh and not a book. We did not write the New Testament and canonize the Christian Scriptures to be used outside of the Church but as the written supplement to God’s Word which contains both the written and the oral Sacred Traditions. The Bible was certainly inspired by God but it did not fall down from heaven in Elizabethan English. The fact is that the will of Jesus for all Christians is that we do accept the teaching of His Church for at the garden of Gethsemane the night of His arrest He prayed that we all be one in His Church just as He and the Father are one. The Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth lest you call Jesus a liar and an imposter as the Messiah. So, are you calling Jesus a liar by rejecting the authority He gave on earth to His Church which is called the one, holy, Catholic and apostolic Church? There is no other.
(Mako Koizumi) My friend, have you ever thoroughly read the bible? From Genesis TO Revelations, have you, my brother, read it? The truth is from Jesus' teachings, not the doctrines and teachings from your "Mother Church of Rome".
False teachers? No, no, no. It is not my way to just listen to the people and NOT dig into the facts. All these things that I did find were not words from people. It was from research.
(Cristoiglesia) I have read the Bible many times and have taught it to others thoroughly. Are you aware that the entire Bible is taught in the Catholic Church every three years? Have you read the Bible including the New Testament which contains the Testimony of our founders to the teaching of Jesus? But, I have also read the teaching of the Church fathers and of the Church of which Jesus gave all authority on earth. So, what makes you think that your own judgment and intellect is greater than the promise of Jesus that His Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth”? Whether it is one false teacher (yourself) or many you are still the victim of deception by the father of lies and the carnal condition of pride and arrogance that you can usurp the authority that Jesus has given to His Church.
(Mako Koizumi) "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."
-Matthew 16:18
That is not referring to the Catholic church.
(Cristoiglesia) It most certainly is referring to His Church. St. Ignatius who was the third bishop of the bishopric of St. Peter in Antioch and a disciple of St. Peter and of St. John defined the Church as those who gather around the Bishop in apostolic succession. Do you know more about the definition of the Church than one who learned at the foot of two of our Lord’s chosen; who are two of the foundation stones of the Church according to our Lord? Why is this not an example of pride as well as disobedience?
Here is where you were bearing false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) Did you know the Catholic church also:
a. Departed from faith - They teach different ways to get into heaven. Examples are purgatory and good deeds (things that are strictly not stated in the bible).
(Cristoiglesia) You obviously do not know what the Church teaches about faith. The Church teaches that we are saved by God’s grace through faith. What do you believe different than this? People who go through the process of purgation are already saved and are being thoroughly cleaned of the dross of sin before they can come into the presence of God. There are no sinful souls in heaven. Good deeds which certainly are evidence of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit do not merit heaven and this is not the teaching of the Church. That would be the heresy of Pelagianism and this is forbidden for Catholic Christians to believe or practice. So, this is your first bearing of false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) b. Give heed to seducing spirits - Catholic church has necromancers. These are "mages" who conjure the spirits of the dead to predict or influence future events. That means they consult with the dead which God strongly condemns. It is also called witch craft. (I have proofs if you need any)
(Cristoiglesia) This is the official teaching of the Church from the Catechism of the Catholic Church in regards to your claim:
Divination and magic
2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility. [305]
2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to "unveil" the future. [Cf. Deut 18:10; Jer 29:8] Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one's service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another's credulity.
So this is the second time you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and its faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) c. Create doctrines of devils - This refers to their fabricated doctrines that do not follow the bible.
(Cristoiglesia) There are no doctrines in Catholic teaching that is contradictory to the Bible. Think about it, why would we write the New Testament and canonize the Bible and then teach contradictory to its truths? Such would be illogical thinking. I noticed that you did not mention any of these so called “doctrines of devils”. Do you realize who you are calling devils? The doctrines come from Christ as taught by His disciples. Did you really mean to make that accusation? This is the third time that you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) d. Speak lies in hypocrisy - They believe, share, and teach what Jesus did not preach in the bible.
(Cristoiglesia) There you go again, empty accusations which have no basis in fact. We would never do such a thing. Here you have chosen to bear false witness for the fourth time against Christ’s Church and it’s faithful.
(Mako Koizumi) e. Forbid to marry - This can refer to nuns, but I believe it's pointing more to the homosexuals. The Catholic church is accepting to homosexuality and some even become one themselves. According to the bible, marriage is done with man AND woman. So, whoever does not follow this is forbidding to marry.
(Cristoiglesia) Are you accusing the Church of forbidding anyone to marry? That is a very serious accusation in the light that the first commandment was to go fourth and multiply. The truth is that the Church does not forbid anyone to marry but instead encourages marriage. There are some who choose a celibate life following the example of our Lord and St. Paul but no one forbids them to marry but they make that choice themselves in devotion to our Lord and the Church. Both Jesus and St. Paul taught in favor of the total dedication to the service of the Lord.
What do you mean that we are accepting of homosexuality? The Church condemns these practices. We would agree with you about the definition of marriage so how are we forbidding anyone to marry? We are not. So, for the fifth time you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.
You made five claims against the Church that are totally false yet you cannot see where you are committing a grave and egregious sin. If that is not deception I do not know how one would define what you have done.
I believe that someone has taught you these lies about the Church and caused you to sin and to embarrass yourself by repeating the lies. Now that you know the truth you can testify to those that would tell lies about he Church that what they say is false. You are in a position to stop others from sinning and making the same errors as yourself. I thank you for the opportunity to enlighten you to your errors. I pray that your enlightenment about Christ’s own Church will get you on a path to communion into the familial relationship with our Savior in His Church. God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
Discussion with LottaLou about the blood of Christ and redemption
(Cristoiglesia) You're very wrong to believe Christians are free from sin & all those that sin are reprobate souls. We're certainly not forgiven of future sins that are not confessed and repented.
(LottaLou) I know Christians sin. I sin. But I don't make a comfortable habit of it. I repent when the Lord convicts me of something. He makes me right. The Holy Spirit is always with me. The blood covers all sins, past present & future.
Salvation is the Gift of God. We are saved by Grace through faith, and not of our works lest we boast... Eternal life is purchased for us on the Cross. What rewards we receive is based on our obedience & deeds done rooted in faith, hope & love... Perishable deeds R fried.
(Cristoiglesia) 1 John 1:6-10 (King James Version)
6If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
8If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
I am not sure what you meant when you said that “the blood covers our sins.”
I am hopeful that you did not mean that His blood cloaks us in some way, as is taught in the heretical Calvinist teaching, to allow a sinful soul to enter heaven and come into the presence of God. Such is not the teaching of the Bible and Christ’s Church.
Here St. John is teaching against the claims of false teachers who may teach that we can be in a familial relationship with God and still in darkness. Such teachers speak of the carnal self as being worthless and lost to sin in which one indulged themselves in sin or would discipline themselves from sin but that in any case it did not matter because the body would be destroyed and corrupted. The truth is to love God is to no longer be a slave to sin. He begins by speaking of our fellowship and communion with one another in Christ’s one Church. Only this relationship is blessed by the Holy Spirit and becomes a living faith instead of a dead faith lacking the fruits of the Spirit which are our works. It is the Spirit that convicts us of our sin and as a result there is no condemnation for those who remain in Christ as the Spirit appeals to the law on our hearts to seek forgiveness in Him and Through His sacrifice.(Rom 8:1) In contrition and repentance we are restored when we err and fall for the snares of Satan. Christ’s Blood cleanses us of all sin.
In the Old Testament the faithful transferred their sin to an animal which was sacrificed. Their forgiveness was earned by their faith and obedience. But in this practice there really was no actual forgiveness of sin in the sense that the person still remained the same sinful soul whose sin was paid for through faith and obedience but there was not a cleansing or removal of the sin which came with Jesus’ sacrifice which was the true Lamb of God who does remove the sin of the world. He removed the spiritual death that comes with unrepentant sin. He brings us His kingdom and a new familial relationship with Him through a New Covenant. He said “It is finished” on the cross and the Old Covenant of animal sacrifices for sin to a New Covenant abiding in Him and trusting in Him in His kingdom for truly the last cup, the cup of consummation was drank from the Hyssop branch which served the Israelites to protect their child by sprinkling the blood of the lamb, that same branch spread the New covenant to all mankind as a protection of His sacrifice and His blood upon mankind. He drank from the hyssop branch by sucking on the sponge and then said to the entire world that the perfect Lamb of God had conquered the sin of man. At the last supper He said that He would not drink from the cup of consummation until His kingdom come. It is truly the kingdom of the Lamb.
In conclusion, it is not a covering of the blood as in a cloak that is the work of Christ. For a covering of our sin is not effectual in gaining our presence with God as no sin will be in His presence even covered in God’s blood? Such would be a delusion of man and a false assurance as taught by Calvin. Such is not the work of Christ. The blood applied by the atoning sacrifice of Christ is not a cloak to sneak a sinful soul into heaven but instead it cleanses our soul and purifies so that we can be with God in the form of the soul of Adam before the fall of man. God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
(LottaLou) I know Christians sin. I sin. But I don't make a comfortable habit of it. I repent when the Lord convicts me of something. He makes me right. The Holy Spirit is always with me. The blood covers all sins, past present & future.
Salvation is the Gift of God. We are saved by Grace through faith, and not of our works lest we boast... Eternal life is purchased for us on the Cross. What rewards we receive is based on our obedience & deeds done rooted in faith, hope & love... Perishable deeds R fried.
(Cristoiglesia) 1 John 1:6-10 (King James Version)
6If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
8If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
I am not sure what you meant when you said that “the blood covers our sins.”
I am hopeful that you did not mean that His blood cloaks us in some way, as is taught in the heretical Calvinist teaching, to allow a sinful soul to enter heaven and come into the presence of God. Such is not the teaching of the Bible and Christ’s Church.
Here St. John is teaching against the claims of false teachers who may teach that we can be in a familial relationship with God and still in darkness. Such teachers speak of the carnal self as being worthless and lost to sin in which one indulged themselves in sin or would discipline themselves from sin but that in any case it did not matter because the body would be destroyed and corrupted. The truth is to love God is to no longer be a slave to sin. He begins by speaking of our fellowship and communion with one another in Christ’s one Church. Only this relationship is blessed by the Holy Spirit and becomes a living faith instead of a dead faith lacking the fruits of the Spirit which are our works. It is the Spirit that convicts us of our sin and as a result there is no condemnation for those who remain in Christ as the Spirit appeals to the law on our hearts to seek forgiveness in Him and Through His sacrifice.(Rom 8:1) In contrition and repentance we are restored when we err and fall for the snares of Satan. Christ’s Blood cleanses us of all sin.
In the Old Testament the faithful transferred their sin to an animal which was sacrificed. Their forgiveness was earned by their faith and obedience. But in this practice there really was no actual forgiveness of sin in the sense that the person still remained the same sinful soul whose sin was paid for through faith and obedience but there was not a cleansing or removal of the sin which came with Jesus’ sacrifice which was the true Lamb of God who does remove the sin of the world. He removed the spiritual death that comes with unrepentant sin. He brings us His kingdom and a new familial relationship with Him through a New Covenant. He said “It is finished” on the cross and the Old Covenant of animal sacrifices for sin to a New Covenant abiding in Him and trusting in Him in His kingdom for truly the last cup, the cup of consummation was drank from the Hyssop branch which served the Israelites to protect their child by sprinkling the blood of the lamb, that same branch spread the New covenant to all mankind as a protection of His sacrifice and His blood upon mankind. He drank from the hyssop branch by sucking on the sponge and then said to the entire world that the perfect Lamb of God had conquered the sin of man. At the last supper He said that He would not drink from the cup of consummation until His kingdom come. It is truly the kingdom of the Lamb.
In conclusion, it is not a covering of the blood as in a cloak that is the work of Christ. For a covering of our sin is not effectual in gaining our presence with God as no sin will be in His presence even covered in God’s blood? Such would be a delusion of man and a false assurance as taught by Calvin. Such is not the work of Christ. The blood applied by the atoning sacrifice of Christ is not a cloak to sneak a sinful soul into heaven but instead it cleanses our soul and purifies so that we can be with God in the form of the soul of Adam before the fall of man. God bless!
In Christ
Fr. Joseph
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)