Mr. Cameron was obvious offended by a response I made about those who spread hatred against Christ’s own Church. What I wrote and posted on another public forum was this:
(M. A. Cameron) Fr. Joseph Well said my brother in Christ? May I use this?
(Cristoiglesia) Your sarcasm is noted.
(M. A. Cameron) If I were to respond in kind It would go like this. Step away from the child (no not for that reason is your mind in the gutter?) because the inquisition is back on!
(Cristoiglesia) I assume you are somehow offended by the picture of my grand-daughter and I. Such offense is your own problem and not mine.
(M. A. Cameron) IF I did that I would not be "telling the truth in Love" and would bring myself down to your level.
(Cristoiglesia) Interesting ad hominem attack.
(M. A. Cameron) "By this all men will know you are my disciples if you have love for one another"? You do know what the greatest commandment is right?
(Cristoiglesia) Yes, and you? I would like to remind you that Jesus was speaking to His Church and not to those in protest of His Church.
(M. A. Cameron) You could have saved a lot of typing and just said ignore them they are all going hell. God bless.
(Cristoiglesia) I am not in the habit of ignoring those who have hatred for Christ’s Church. People full of hatred for what Christ has founded need to be rebuked. I am not another’s judge and I have no knowledge of who will go to hell and who will be saved. Personally I pray that all will be saved.
(M. A. Cameron) False doctrine, Romans 3:4 Let God be true and every man a liar" I follow Jesus because Jesus is God!!! I believe Apostle's who were contemporaries of the Lord Jesus Christ and eyewitnesses to His Glory and wrote the New Testament.
(Cristoiglesia) You claim that you follow Jesus but do your words reflect this claim. We agree that Jesus is God and we agree further that the disciples and apostles were eyewitnesses to the revealing of His glory on the Cross. What belies your words is that you reject the will of Jesus who prayed for unity the night after the last supper, before His arrest, for unity. As A Protestant you reject His stated will and remain outside of His Church in a man-made counterfeit sect by your will and not God’s.
John 17:21-23 (DRA)
21 That they all may be one, as thou, Father, in me, and I in thee; that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
22 And the glory which thou hast given me, I have given to them; that they may be one, as we also are one:
23 I in them, and thou in me; that they may be made perfect in one: and the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast also loved me.
You choose foolishly to stay outside of that unity that God desires of His flock and even suggest that Jesus is a liar. How can you justify rejecting His will?
(M. A. Cameron) That is where it ended Jesus is my rock the chief corner stone of my faith.
(Cristoiglesia) I accept your claim that this was where it ended in your mind and I guess you are able to justify ignoring the rest of Jesus’ teaching and that of the Bible. The Bible states that Jesus is not just the cornerstone but also the high priest of His Church. It says that the 12 disciples are the foundation stones of the Church. As with all foundations this requires a building upon the foundation which are the successors of the disciples. Clearly we see this building up of the Church in the book of Acts. It further states that St. Peter was appointed as the first holder of the enduring office of prime minister as prophesied in Isaiah 22 to fulfill the Scriptures. We must search further to see what the understanding of the Church was in the first and second generations of these successors. I believe that St. Ignatius says it best in his letter to the Smyrnaeans saying: “where the bishop is there is the Church”. There is no suggestion that a Church can exist without this divine structure. We can deduce from the construction vernacular used by Jesus that He was not building a temporary structure as the Bible describes as a house on a foundation of sand but instead an enduring structure meant to last for all times on a foundation of rock…Jesus is the cornerstone, the disciples are the foundation stones and St. Peter represents the rock of the prime minister who holds the keys to the Church and thus to heaven.
(M. A. Cameron) What man is yours the pope? Mary(or woman)?Peter? Have you ever read 1 Corinthians 1:12-13 Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?
(Cristoiglesia) Jesus personally ordained the office of prime minister of which St. Peter was the first to hold the office. When Jesus referred to the blessed mother as “woman” he was pointing out her state of sinlessness as Eve was simply called “woman” before the fall of man at the Garden of Eden. What St. Paul was saying was that all of those who are ordained by God through apostolic succession have the authority of Christ through the sacrament of orders. Christ was crucified atoning for the sins of mankind and His foundation laid with the disciples are evidence equally of His will. St. Paul was reiterating Jesus’ desire for unity and proclaiming God’s will for all men.
(M. A. Cameron) The true Church=All true Christians are there some in the catholic church YES! (as long as they do not think like you)are there some in every other Christian church YES!
(Cristoiglesia) We have some agreement here but what you are describing is the invisible Church. The Orthodox have a very true saying and that is that “we know where the visible Church is but not where it is not.” Surely there is also a visible Church that proclaims His glory and is testimony to His promises. He says of His Church that it will endure for all times….only the Catholic Church can represent this claim. The Bible says that the Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth”. This witness cannot only be invisible to be a testimony to His promises and the promises of the Bible about His Church. In fact the Bible states the opposite saying that the Church is a shining city on a hill that cannot be hidden. It is truly a beacon to all humanity that His promises and the teaching of Scriptures is true.
(M. A. Cameron) What makes a cult (or sect) usually 3 things: Deny the deity of Christ ,believe they are the only true church, add to or take away from the Word of God(The living Word is Jesus)not false teachers adding to, the catholic church has maybe added more than any.
(Cristoiglesia) Certainly denying the deity of Christ separates one from the Church is a mark of a false heretical sect. However your second characteristic of a cult denies that Jesus founded a true Church. Both Jesus and the Bible testify that Jesus founded only One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church and that is the Catholic Church. I would remind you that the historical and patristic evidence of this fact are undeniable as well.
On your third characteristic which is the adding or taking away from God’s Word… First you limit God’s Word to that which is written in the Scriptures. But we know that Jesus was the Word made flesh and as a result all that He taught is His Word and is not just limited to the written. The Bible tells us that it does NOT contain all of His teaching and teaches that for all of His teaching we must rely on His Church which is the “pillar and foundation of the truth”. As I have told you the Church are those who gather around the bishops according to the first century understanding of Church. The Church adds to the Word of God only as His witness to the world of Christ’s veracity in His promises. Conversely those of the Protestant sects take away from God’s Word and even have the audacity without any authority to remove seven whole books of God’s Word and not only deny this teaching from their followers but proclaim it false. Instead they follow the Canon of the Jews instead of the Christian Canon.
(M. A. Cameron) Should we be reading our BIBLE? Please read and think about 1 Peter 2 King James Version Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speaking 2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:3 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious.
(Cristoiglesia) Of course we should be reading the Bible and understanding it in the community of the Church as the Bible teaches. It is not for private interpretation as such only creates errors and pride fullness. The “sincere milk of the Word” is only available with all its fullness in Christ’s own Church.
(M. A. Cameron) Mary Matthew 12:47 Then one said to Him, “Look, Your mother and Your brothers are standing outside, seeking to speak with You.”48 But He answered and said to the one who told Him, “Who is My mother and who are My brothers?” 49 And He stretched out His hand toward His disciples and said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! 50 For whoever does the will of My Father in heaven is My brother and sister and mother.”
(Cristoiglesia) It seems as if you are suggesting that Jesus broke one of God’s commandments in the Decalogue by not honoring His mother. Jesus never broke even one commandment must less this one. Shame is on you for suggesting that Jesus sinned. Jesus simply used this opportunity to illustrate that those who do His will are blessed even to eternal life and was telling them to focus on His teaching through His disciples rather than the presence His mother and cousins which was distracting them.
(M. A. Cameron) I could go on and on. Joseph that was the most hateful thing I have ever heard directed from one Christian to another (assuming you are one)
(Cristoiglesia) You seem to find the truth as a “hateful thing”. I have no hate for anyone but instead love all of God’s children. Could it be that it is your conscience (assuming you have one) is convicting you of your guilt in remaining outside of God’s will. He will continue to try to reveal the truth of His word and His will to you through His grace. At some point you should stop rejecting this grace and come into unity with Him in His Church. For the seeking Christian swimming the Tiber is a very short and fulfilling exercise. It is like going from the darkness of error into the light of truth. Thank you for the opportunity to contend for the faith delivered once for all. God bless!