24 July, 2009

Discussion with Mako Koizumi about criticisms of the Church

(Mako Koizumi) Oh, I apologize if I have offended you or your religion in the slightest way possible. However, yes, I am very, very aware that everything I posted about the Catholic church is the wholesome truth. Everything.

(Cristoiglesia) I did not respond to you because I was offended although the false accusations you made are quite offensive. The reason I did so was to encourage you to repent from your sin of bearing false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful. It was from a concern for your soul that it may remain unrepentant for your sin and will die to Christ as a result.

It seems as if you have been the victim of false teachers and that is sad for they have caused you to commit the sin of bearing false witness which is against the Decalogue."

(Mako Koizumi) Actually, that cannot be possible for I have not been taught by false teachers.

(Cristoiglesia) OK, then where did you get the nonsense you posted about Christ’s Church?

(Mako Koizumi) I am assuming what you have shared must be the Catholic way. However, as a Christian, I am not permitted to ALWAYS accept the teachings from higher authority. People are still people. And so, these people who are said to be "holy" can quite be the opposite. But what I do cater to and embrace is the bible, the only God-given truth sent down from heaven.

(Cristoiglesia) I see. So you reject the authority that Christ placed on earth which is His Church for a book about the Church and written by the Church (New Testament) but do not accept the teaching of the Church which the Bible states is the “pillar and foundation of the truth. The Bible further states that it does not contain the fullness of truth of Jesus’ teaching that is contained in the teaching of the Church and preserved by apostolic succession and the teaching authority of the Church given by Jesus. It seems as if you call yourself Christian and then turn from the familial relationship that Jesus founded through His Church for the doctrines of men instead of Christ’s authority given to the Church. That real makes no sense, does it? Jesus is the Word made flesh and not a book. We did not write the New Testament and canonize the Christian Scriptures to be used outside of the Church but as the written supplement to God’s Word which contains both the written and the oral Sacred Traditions. The Bible was certainly inspired by God but it did not fall down from heaven in Elizabethan English. The fact is that the will of Jesus for all Christians is that we do accept the teaching of His Church for at the garden of Gethsemane the night of His arrest He prayed that we all be one in His Church just as He and the Father are one. The Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth lest you call Jesus a liar and an imposter as the Messiah. So, are you calling Jesus a liar by rejecting the authority He gave on earth to His Church which is called the one, holy, Catholic and apostolic Church? There is no other.

(Mako Koizumi) My friend, have you ever thoroughly read the bible? From Genesis TO Revelations, have you, my brother, read it? The truth is from Jesus' teachings, not the doctrines and teachings from your "Mother Church of Rome".
False teachers? No, no, no. It is not my way to just listen to the people and NOT dig into the facts. All these things that I did find were not words from people. It was from research.

(Cristoiglesia) I have read the Bible many times and have taught it to others thoroughly. Are you aware that the entire Bible is taught in the Catholic Church every three years? Have you read the Bible including the New Testament which contains the Testimony of our founders to the teaching of Jesus? But, I have also read the teaching of the Church fathers and of the Church of which Jesus gave all authority on earth. So, what makes you think that your own judgment and intellect is greater than the promise of Jesus that His Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth”? Whether it is one false teacher (yourself) or many you are still the victim of deception by the father of lies and the carnal condition of pride and arrogance that you can usurp the authority that Jesus has given to His Church.

(Mako Koizumi) "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."
-Matthew 16:18
That is not referring to the Catholic church.

(Cristoiglesia) It most certainly is referring to His Church. St. Ignatius who was the third bishop of the bishopric of St. Peter in Antioch and a disciple of St. Peter and of St. John defined the Church as those who gather around the Bishop in apostolic succession. Do you know more about the definition of the Church than one who learned at the foot of two of our Lord’s chosen; who are two of the foundation stones of the Church according to our Lord? Why is this not an example of pride as well as disobedience?

Here is where you were bearing false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.

(Mako Koizumi) Did you know the Catholic church also:

a. Departed from faith - They teach different ways to get into heaven. Examples are purgatory and good deeds (things that are strictly not stated in the bible).

(Cristoiglesia) You obviously do not know what the Church teaches about faith. The Church teaches that we are saved by God’s grace through faith. What do you believe different than this? People who go through the process of purgation are already saved and are being thoroughly cleaned of the dross of sin before they can come into the presence of God. There are no sinful souls in heaven. Good deeds which certainly are evidence of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit do not merit heaven and this is not the teaching of the Church. That would be the heresy of Pelagianism and this is forbidden for Catholic Christians to believe or practice. So, this is your first bearing of false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.

(Mako Koizumi) b. Give heed to seducing spirits - Catholic church has necromancers. These are "mages" who conjure the spirits of the dead to predict or influence future events. That means they consult with the dead which God strongly condemns. It is also called witch craft. (I have proofs if you need any)

(Cristoiglesia) This is the official teaching of the Church from the Catechism of the Catholic Church in regards to your claim:
Divination and magic
2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility. [305]
2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to "unveil" the future. [Cf. Deut 18:10; Jer 29:8] Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one's service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another's credulity.
So this is the second time you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and its faithful.

(Mako Koizumi) c. Create doctrines of devils - This refers to their fabricated doctrines that do not follow the bible.

(Cristoiglesia) There are no doctrines in Catholic teaching that is contradictory to the Bible. Think about it, why would we write the New Testament and canonize the Bible and then teach contradictory to its truths? Such would be illogical thinking. I noticed that you did not mention any of these so called “doctrines of devils”. Do you realize who you are calling devils? The doctrines come from Christ as taught by His disciples. Did you really mean to make that accusation? This is the third time that you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.

(Mako Koizumi) d. Speak lies in hypocrisy - They believe, share, and teach what Jesus did not preach in the bible.

(Cristoiglesia) There you go again, empty accusations which have no basis in fact. We would never do such a thing. Here you have chosen to bear false witness for the fourth time against Christ’s Church and it’s faithful.

(Mako Koizumi) e. Forbid to marry - This can refer to nuns, but I believe it's pointing more to the homosexuals. The Catholic church is accepting to homosexuality and some even become one themselves. According to the bible, marriage is done with man AND woman. So, whoever does not follow this is forbidding to marry.

(Cristoiglesia) Are you accusing the Church of forbidding anyone to marry? That is a very serious accusation in the light that the first commandment was to go fourth and multiply. The truth is that the Church does not forbid anyone to marry but instead encourages marriage. There are some who choose a celibate life following the example of our Lord and St. Paul but no one forbids them to marry but they make that choice themselves in devotion to our Lord and the Church. Both Jesus and St. Paul taught in favor of the total dedication to the service of the Lord.

What do you mean that we are accepting of homosexuality? The Church condemns these practices. We would agree with you about the definition of marriage so how are we forbidding anyone to marry? We are not. So, for the fifth time you have chosen to bear false witness against Christ’s Church and His faithful.

You made five claims against the Church that are totally false yet you cannot see where you are committing a grave and egregious sin. If that is not deception I do not know how one would define what you have done.

I believe that someone has taught you these lies about the Church and caused you to sin and to embarrass yourself by repeating the lies. Now that you know the truth you can testify to those that would tell lies about he Church that what they say is false. You are in a position to stop others from sinning and making the same errors as yourself. I thank you for the opportunity to enlighten you to your errors. I pray that your enlightenment about Christ’s own Church will get you on a path to communion into the familial relationship with our Savior in His Church. God bless!

In Christ
Fr. Joseph

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